The Language of the Kingdom

I found ch 16 of the McLaren book to be very interesting. I understand the author's pursuit to translate a bible that speaks to current times and understands, but I wonder if his attempts fall short of what was orginally being said. First off, the author strives to think of new metaphors for the "kingdom of God" in order to modernize it in a way that doesn't seem exclusionairy from the new global prespective. However, I find that the author actually seems to exclude a great number of individuals living around the world. The new translations seem to focus on an American perspectivie for understanding the kingdom in a way that defeats the purpose in my opinion. When I think of the Kingdom of God, I think of the entire earth, all its peoples, and a plethra of languages, understandings, values and beliefs. I find it difficult to stand behind any of the new metahphors the author provided because they do not seem to keep in mind all people and all places. McLaren says "Why is kingdom language not as dynamic today? First, because in our world, kingdoms are a thing of the past. They've given way to republics and democracies and democratic republics. Now, authority resides in constitutions and parliaments and congresses" (McLaren 138-139). However, this statement seems one-sided and ethnocentric, speaking from an American or Western Europe point of view. Not all countries have these forms of government or think of kingdoms, in a lingustic sense, as being from the past. I find that I prefer the orginal language to the alternitives presented here.

Kingdom Ethics

McLaren says that "The Kingdom of God is a revolutionary, counter cultural movement proclaiming a ceaseless rebellion against the trinity of money, sex, and power. Its citizens resist the occupation of this invisible Caesar through three categories of spiritual practice. First, they practice a liberating generosity toward the poor to dethrone greed and topple the regime of money. Second, they practice a kind of prayer that is defiant act of resistance against the prideful pursuit of power, pursuing forgiveness and reconciliation, not retaliation and revenge. Finally, they practice fasting to revolt against the dominating impulses of physical gratification- so that the sex drive and other physical appetites will not become our slaves drivers. All these are practiced covertly, in secret, so they aren't corrupted into an external show "as the hypocrites do"

1. What do you think about these words ?
2. How revolutionary is the Message of Jesus?
3. Is the fact that the message is counter cultural the reason why some might reject it?

Teaching a Guy to Fish

I've noticed a pervading theme throughout the McLaren book so far - the question of whether Jesus' message could have been delivered in a more straightforward way. I think what the author seems to be getting at is that no, his message would not have been (and would not be today) as effective if told a different way. What keeps coming to my mind is the old saying about teaching a man to fish, rather than giving him a fish. Jesus could have walked around, plainly stating, "I am the way to eternal happiness in life and after death, so do as I say and you will secure your place in the kingdom of God", but that would have been as effective as giving a hungry man a fish. Instead, Christ used parables, mystery, and secrecy to encourage critical thinking - to teach the man how to fish.

Questions on chapter 6 -- "Medium of the message"

In your opinion is use of parables a good way to convey a message?

In class we discussed pros and cons of using  analogies. In many cases parables from bible are boiled down to easy to grasp explanations by religious author, preachers, theologians. Is such practice justified? Does it impede a more personal understand of the teachings of Jesus or is it necessary?

Would you say a more straight forward message would have more or less effect in reaching the general population? In the chapter author argues that Jesus is trying to reach those who will listen with their heart, not everyone; is this still true in this day in age, when religion is an integral part of the mass culture?

Please add comments with your answers.
Alex.

Response to McLaren's Questions

Good News for Everyone:

I think that Jesus's message actually is for all different religions. We learn that God created man so therefore he must have been prepared for humans to question their beliefs and other's beliefs. When Jesus spread his message, I think he intended to spread the message to everyone, not just Christians. I don't think it matters what religion or what beliefs you have. Jesus came to spread his message so that we could become better people and learn to live like him. I think this would make a huge difference in the world. As a society, we "exclude" people because of their religion so the possibility that Jesus's message is for everyone would be a big deal. In my opinion, all religions are roughly the same, they are just interpreting his message differently.

Jesus' Secret Plan:

We may never know what Jesus planned to do when he spread his message. He might not have known either! I think he came to change the world. While he was doing so, he sort of laid down a "secret plan" for us to figure out. He definitely did not make it easy to interpret and I think he did that intentionally. Why should he make it so easy? I think what he wanted to do was "hide" the plan so that the people who truly deserve it, the people who spend time trying to figure it out, are the ones that reap the benefits of it.

McLaren respones

What about religion?
It seems as though we have now created a world where religion is taught and preached but people never intend to follow through with the messages and lifestyles they preach. Everyone lives a lifestyle that is different from what was exhibited by Jesus. It is impossible to live in our modern society without sinning at least every day. I believe individuals try to follow in Jesus' example but I believe that it is an impossible lifestyle to achieve.

Good News for Everyone?
I believe that the message Jesus had was intended for every living being, whether you are Christian, Jewish, Muslim, etc. Jesus showed love for all people in the world and lived with a very inclusive rather than exclusive personality. We can take His message and include it in our everyday life or not, that decision is left to us, but His message was intended to apply to anyone despite their religious background.

Good News for Everyone? (answer)

I think Jesus and God love everyone in the world no matter what their religious preference is. I think that his teachings say that in order to be saved and reach heaven then you have to follow his teachings and worship only one God, and he would like his word spread to everyone not just current followers. I think it's the responsibility of all Christians to spread God's word.

What About Religion? (answer)

I think that Jesus taught his followers a certain way of doing things and that's how it's supposed to be done. I don't think he set out all these guidelines to live by so that they could be refined, but so that could be followed directly. Obviously nobody's perfect but perfection is something that should be striven for.

McLaren Responses

What about Religion?

I think that we have lost a lot of the personhood of Jesus. He was God and man - wholly both. He had plans for how life should be lived and how the world should be run. This includes the life of each of his followers. In my own life I have frequently encountered individuals who associate nothing but hypocrisy and social stratification with the church -- and this is extremely sad. We were called to love one another as ourselves -- and we certainly wouldn't want to judged and ostracized so why do we condemn one another so often? Why do we perseve different as wrong? Jesus is often respected but also often misunderstood. He was a teacher - a rabbi to his followers. He tought us how to live, how to think, and how to treat one another -- and yet we choose to go against his wishes so irreverently. Respect is not enough - we must live as Jesus lived -- and He lived with a love that we can hardly begin to understand, but should strive to with all our might.

Good News for Everyone?

Jesus' message is absolutely positively for everyone man, woman, and child on this Earth -- not only those born in America, not only those born to Christian parents, not only those who profess His name even. The life of Jesus not only inspired a religion, but a dramatic shift in way of life.

Responses to McLaren

Respond to McLaren's question: "What if his message directly or indirectly addressed issues like advertising, environmentalism, terrorism, economics, sexuality, marriage, parenting, the quest for happiness and peace, and racial reconciliation?"(p. 4)

If Jesus’ message answered these questions then he would be stepping out of his box as a teacher. We seem to forget that Jesus was mainly a teacher while he was on Earth. And a good teacher gives you the information you need and maybe a few hints, but never the answer. Jesus has given us all the information we need through his lessons, and for him to answer the questions above would be for him to no longer be a teacher.

Respond to McLaren's questions: "What if we have developed a religion that makes reverent and honoring statements about Jesus but doesn't teach what Jesus taught in the manner he taught it? What if the religion generally associated with Jesus neither expects nor trains its adherents to actually live in the way of Jesus? (p.3)"

For an individual to live a life just like Jesus is impossible. He is a man without sin, and we as humans are all born into a sin and many of us sin every day. For that reason we are cannot live in the way Jesus did even if we wanted to. Now if a religion leaves out Jesus’ teaching power then it is taking away from one of the many reasons Jesus was placed on the earth. Jesus was placed on the earth to teach and show us the way in which to live our lives so that we could enter heaven one day. Jesus’ teachings were meant to cause people to think and by just giving honor to his statements it does not have the full affect. It would be like hearing a movie, but without action. And actions speak louder than words.

Re. McLaren

McLaren: What about religion?

When thinking about this question, I cannot but shrug off a feeling that 'what would Jesus do' in Christianity today, is the slogan that does belong on a bumper sticker. On daily basis we are witnesses of people who claim to be living the life of faith, acting completely opposite then how Jesus would act. I would have to say, that the life of Jesus and his actions are studied less in Churches, and that people, instead of looking at who Jesus really was and what he did, would rather just praise Jesus, and make 'reverent and honoring statements' about Him.

McLaren: What Issues?

While it is important to understand teachings and life of Jesus in a specific context, it is also very important to look at the universal principles of justice, love, morality...that Jesus teaches. When thinking about terrorism, sexuality, economics, one must first understand the life of Jesus, and refrain from subjective views and personal beliefs about these issues. And while we can like some rejoice to the signs of climate change (global warming), as signs of Jesus' return, we must combine his teachings of love, respect and justice when dealing with economics, environmentalism, terrorism.

Re: Good News for Everyone

Respond to McLaren's questions: "What if the message of Jesus was good news--not just for Christians but also for Jews, Buddhists, Muslims, Hindus, New Agers, agnostics, and atheists? And what if the message of Jesu contained warnings for Jews, Buddhists, Muslims, Hindus, New Agers, agnostics, atheists--and for Christians too? What difference could it make in the lives of individuals, in their families and neighborhoods and circles of friends and in the world at large?"

In my own personal opinion I feel that Jesus IS good news for everyone. Not just Christians. Jesus' love for the entire world was shown when he died on the cross. It wasn't just for the Christians, it was for every single person on earth. It is our decision on whether or not we accept that fact. If warnings were contained in the message of Jesus, I feel that it would be in our best interest to follow them very carefully. I feel that any message from Him is very important, to say the least.

Re: What About Religion?

Respond to McLaren's questions: "What if we have developed a religion that makes reverent and honoring statements about Jesus but doesn't teach what Jesus taught in the manner he taught it? What if the religion generally associated with Jesus neither expects nor trains its adherents to actually live in the way of Jesus? (p.3)"

In many ways I feel that everyone has their moments throughout a day, week, month,etc. where we may have our sins and try to justify them in one way or another...Soon enough it may become a habit that we've created! We say that we try to live by how Jesus' lived his life but we are too worldly to fully commit ourselves to that process. By doing this process, which everyone does (especially myself), we are maybe honoring verses from the bible out of respect, but we are doing nothing to 'walk-the-walk'.

Exclusivity of Christ message

I would first like to say that i believe that Jesus' message was for all peoples and that it is through this transformational message that Christ is able to refine our cultural underpinnings. Thereby, a middle eastern man can follow Christ using the medium of his own language. why do I say all this, it is because although Christ invites everybody to follow him he does not expect every one to do so. Therefore, while his message is of love it is not necessary all inclusive. That's why he said I am the way, the truth and the life, no comes to the father except through me. I believe this was an exclusive claim. However it does not diminish the power of the message to unite people from various backgrounds and denominations. I know this is controversial so I will wait for your response before adding more.

Largest Common Denomination

“What if we have developed a religion that makes reverent and honoring statements about Jesus but doesn't teach what Jesus taught in the manner he taught it? What if the religion generally associated with Jesus neither expects nor trains its adherents to actually live in the way of Jesus?”

Unfortunately, this seems to be the reality. In the centuries since Christianity became a widely established religion, Christians have warred among themselves over a variety of issues: whether men should wear beards or not, what counts as a sin and what does not, ethical issues like abortion and gay marriage, etc. I think that all the denominations splitting away from each other miss the point entirely – Jesus’ message is one of love, not separation. I really believe he cares much less about whether or not you do work on the Sabbath (how you define ‘work’, on which day you celebrate the Sabbath, etc.) than he cares about all people treating each other humanely, with a sense of dignity and respect not only for other human lives, but for all life. My knowledge of Jesus and his teachings, though it is admittedly limited, suggests to me that being a good person and treating others well is the main idea of what he wanted for the people of the world, while all that other stuff does not actually matter all that much.

“What if the message of Jesus was good news--not just for Christians but also for Jews, Buddhists, Muslims, Hindus, New Agers, agnostics, and atheists? And what if the message of Jesus contained warnings for Jews, Buddhists, Muslims, Hindus, New Agers, agnostics, atheists--and for Christians too? What difference could it make in the lives of individuals, in their families and neighborhoods and circles of friends and in the world at large?”

I think the message of Jesus, although intended for Christians, is applicable universally. Most organized religions promote in their basic tenets the concepts of compassion, brotherhood, fairness, etc. Many religious myths and folk stories also coincide with the teachings of Jesus in their expression of ‘warning’ tales as well. As I mentioned for the previous question, I feel that what religion you are, whether you eat fish or ham or steak on Friday, how often you pray, does not matter so much as long as you are a good person.

Why now?

Even though Jesus's word was quite a while ago, people are still practicing what he recommends and what he wants all of the followers of God to do. But, there are somethings in the Christianity that has changed over time. In old time Christian women too covered their heads, and it is still seen as inappropriate to show your legs or shoulders in a church. But in today's society instead of always being covered, most people only cover up when they are in the church. The ideals have some what watered down. So my point in this is saying that even if Jesus said all of these things about Advertisements and things, in this day in age I believe that the strictness of these issues would have diluted by now. This could happen or maybe we would be similar to the Muslims. In Islam you cannot have a picture, drawing or anything of Mohammed. So maybe like them we would still respect his wishes and not have anything that would offend him in our media. It is hard to tell in today's society.

Nothing

If Jesus's message was for every religion I don't think that much would change. When it comes to Christianity, Islam, and Judaism nothing would really change because all of these three religions are extremely similar. Judaism and Christianity share the old testament, and Islam recognizes Jesus as a prophet. For Buddhism and Hinduism, they would probably consider the message, but their own personal way of like is somewhat Christian itself.

The one thing that I do think that would be effected would be our own attitudes for each other. Christians would stop trying to force Jesus down other religions throats because Jesus spoke to all. And other religions maybe would keep rejecting his thoughts and ideas, or maybe they would be like the other western religions and accept his advice.

A good article that fits perfectly with our class.

McLaren: Good News for Everyone?

Respond to McLaren's questions: "What if the message of Jesus was good news--not just for Christians but also for Jews, Buddhists, Muslims, Hindus, New Agers, agnostics, and atheists?  And what if the message of Jesu contained warnings for Jews, Buddhists, Muslims, Hindus, New Agers, agnostics, atheists--and for Christians too?  What difference could it make in the lives of individuals, in their families and neighborhoods and circles of friends and in the world at large?" (p. 4)

McLaren: What Issues?

Respond to McLaren's question: "What if his message directly or indirectly addressed issues like advertising, environmentalism, terrorism, economics, sexuality, marriage, parenting, the quest for happiness and peace, and racial reconciliation?"(p. 4)